Pääasia podcast about working life

Klaus Kuhanen was fired a year ago and is still processing the situation

In the Mehiläinen Pääasia podcast about working life, we discuss phenomena related to working life with our specialists and company guests. We will have open discussions about leadership and supervisory work as well as changes in working life. In this episode, occupational psychologist Kimmo Haapanen’s guest is freelance writer Klaus Kuhanen. The episode discusses getting fired. What kinds of emotions does being fired from a job evoke? And how should feelings of failure and shame be approached?

Klaus Kuhanen’s last job was that of CEO. After more than twenty years as a CEO, Kuhanen was fired from his job.

“In my opinion, the CEO should always be aware of the fact that they may lose their job,” Kuhanen says.

“My firing was preceded by a period of some months, during which it started to become clear that the business was not going as it should. The feeling that I’m going to get fired became more concrete than ever before.”

A year ago, Kuhanen met with his supervisor, who told him that he was going to be fired. Since then, he has written about being fired in his Potkut.com blog. On the day he was fired, he experienced a variety of emotions. He was nervous about the meeting with his supervisor, but after the firing discussion, his body and mind calmed down.

“I think it depends on your personality. I have noticed before in my life that in such a unique situation, my first reaction is to feel calm. Stronger reactions usually come a little later, after a few days.”

Before being fired, Klaus Kuhanen had managed to build a career spanning more than 40 years, which had included many challenging situations. This kind of work experience also helped him treat being fired as something that will eventually be overcome.

Being fired is a special type of life crisis

Challenging life situations, and even unpleasant surprises, are part of life. After he was fired, Klaus Kuhanen noticed that he had previously done very little to process life events that evoke difficult emotions. He used to try and not think about losses or disappointments, and tried to move forward too quickly.

However, at the time he was fired, he had the space and resources to deal with the thoughts he was having about it. Now, a year later, the process seems to be still going on.

“It feels like this work is still going on. I don’t know how much longer it will take.”

A firing is also a sudden change for other members of the work community. Kuhanen explains how the different personalities in his work community came to light when it was announced at a joint meeting that the company was firing him. For some, the news didn’t seem to mean anything, while others even started to cry.
Distressed co-workers had a great need to talk to the fired CEO.

“For one reason or another, I chose the role of a person who consoles others. They did not come to console me. On the contrary, I consoled people and assured them that life would go on,” Kuhanen says.

It was easy for Kuhanen to tell his family that he had been fired, because Kuhanen was used to sharing not only his joys but also his sorrows with his family. Surprisingly, Kuhanen’s eldest child congratulated his father on being fired. Kuhanen says that he did not at first understand why he was being congratulated, but has later realised that being fired was also a lucky push in a new direction.

“I felt that it was important to tell my family and friends at a rather early stage. I thought that the more openly and quickly I tell them about it, the less I would bottle up the issue. Being fired can be traumatic, so I definitely didn’t want to get stuck on it.”

You job can gradually become your identity

Distress, shame, identity crisis and a sense of failure. Such emotions began to fill Klaus Kuhanen’s mind a few days after he was fired. Although Kuhanen was usually talkative and had already been able to talk about being fired with some of his friends, strong emotions would sometimes take over and the words would get stuck in his throat.

The closer the relationship you have with your work, the more you will be affected by adversity at work. Employees for whom working is important in many ways often end up as managers.

“I was one of those people that identifies with their work 110%. I felt that my work was also my favourite hobby.”

For example, Klaus Kuhanen often introduced himself to new people through his work. Now, however, Kuhanen has begun to question whether work was actually the most important thing to him. He has started to see many other aspects and traits in himself besides being a good CEO.

Klaus Kuhanen has written and spoken publicly about being fired, which has resulted in opportunities to discuss the topic with the other people who have also been fired. These encounters have led Kuhanen to wonder why so many people take being fired very personally. After all, it happens to many people during their careers.

“Being fired is a normal, essential part of working life. If you find it a very tough experience – like I did – perhaps you should try to actively process what happened.”

The firing of a CEO is always associated with failure. Failing to succeed in a job that is important to you can give rise to a strong feeling of shame. However, Kuhanen would like to remind listeners that no one goes through life without failing at something. As with other failures, the only option after being fired is to deal with the issue and move on.

Being fired can even cause depression

After being fired, Klaus Kuhanen decided that he would process the emotions evoked by his firing properly. He began to write about his experiences and published a new post on the topic in his blog every week for the first six months.

“I’m the kind of person that can think about things endlessly. But the world only starts to become more concrete when I write down my thoughts.”

When recovering from being fired, you may not move on from disappointment and fears to something better is a straightforward way. It is common for painful emotions to return after better periods, and you may need to deal with these emotions many times. Kuhanen says he was horrified when he searched for information and discovered that being fired can even cause depression.

“I thought that I am certainly not going to get depressed over such a thing. But then I noticed that I also had some of the symptoms, which surprised both me and the people close to me. I have never had such dark thoughts before. But we all have them.”

Processing his dark thoughts taught Kuhanen his fear of depression had been unnecessary. He could deal with his difficult emotions, and they were eventually replaced by familiar, more positive emotions.

In difficult times, social networks can support those who have been fired. Kuhanen noticed that the coffee meetings and lunch dates, which had been part of his everyday work, did not end when he lost his job. He says that invitations from friends and acquaintances to go for coffee have been a great gesture that has given him tremendous support and joy.

The bright side

Processing the emotions that were stirred up when he was fired has taken Klaus Kuhanen a year, and he still doesn’t feel like he has fully moved on. He still thinks about his firing.

This autumn, Kuhanen became eligible for retirement and he seized the opportunity. Like getting fired, retirement also feels like giving something up.

“I define my life one day at a time and think about what it really means to be retired.”

Right now, Kuhanen does not miss working. This new feeling has also been confusing, as he thought for a long time that his work was one of the most important things in his life. He felt that he was at his best when he was working. Now the time has come to look for himself and his other strengths.

“If I had not been fired, I would have kept working for many more years. And now all of a sudden I’m in a situation where I don’t miss working at all. Quite the opposite. My head says you have 40 years of work experience, use it, but my heart says something completely different.”

Varpu Hintsanen is happy that she decided to talk about the loss of her child openly

In the Mehiläinen Pääasia podcast about working life, we discuss phenomena related to working life with our specialists and company guests. We will have open discussions about leadership and supervisory work as well as changes in working life. In this episode, occupational psychologist Miia Rautiainen is accompanied by guest Varpu Hintsanen, who is a psychiatric nurse, mind coach and social media influencer. In the episode, we discuss the expectations towards working life of a person who has experienced loss. Through her business, Varpu Hintsanen helps those who have experienced loss. She is also a mother who has lost her own child.

Loss may be the loss of one’s own health or the loss of a loved one. Severe losses in life are significantly less frequent than other kinds of difficulties and challenges, such as stress or positive life changes. But when one has to face loss, it has a big impact on one’s personal life, work and the lives of one’s loved ones.

As a psychiatric nurse, Varpu Hintsanen has worked with, among others, children, young people and families for more than twenty years. For the last four years, Hintsanen has worked as an entrepreneur. She gives lectures on emotional and mental skills in work communities.

“In addition to being a professional in psychiatry, I am also a mother who has lost a child. Many people can probably relate to the fact that sometimes it only takes a single sentence for everything to change. For me, that happened in the paediatric emergency unit at Tays when I was told that my child has cancer that is difficult to treat,” Hintsanen says.

On the same day, Hintsanen became the carer of her five-year-old daughter. The next day, Hintsanen started organising her work matters. The hospital staff warned her that her child’s treatment period would be long. Hintsanen had no choice but to call her supervisor and tell them that she did not know when she could return to work. She only knew for certain that it would take a long time.

“The situation was startling and shocking to my supervisor, too, and made them emotional. They immediately took control of the situation and assured me that they would take care of everything at work. I felt that I was met with compassion and that people shared my feelings. I didn’t have to feel like I had let my co-workers down.”

Employers can help by giving employees the time they need

Varpu Hintsanen was absent from her job for three years. During this time, she acted as a carer for her child. Hintsanen recalls how her child’s doctor had advised Varpu to forget her own schedules when the treatment started. When treating a serious illness, the treatment plan and the child’s health are all that matter – everything else is secondary.

“Today, people are so used to scheduling everything. We schedule working days, but also leisure time, hobbies, weekends and holidays. Not being able to know what would happen next was already a big change in itself. When I woke up in the morning, I didn’t know whether the night would be spent at home or in the ward.”

When a child is ill, the parents lose control over the family’s everyday life in many ways. Employers can support their employees in the situation by allowing them to forget the schedules. It is important to let the employee know that everything will work out despite their absence. The supervisor should also take responsibility for communicating with the employee and checking on their situation.

Varpu Hintsanen says that as a social media influencer, the question she gets asked the most is how to react when a co-worker or a loved one faces a difficult situation. She points out that it is natural to be at a loss for words in the midst of great sadness. That is also something that can be said out loud to a loved one.

“When we are compassionate, we would usually like to say something that improves or fixes the situation. However, some situations, such as a serious illness or death, cannot be fixed. We have to accept that sometimes there aren’t any words you can say to make it better. It’s okay to say that you don’t know what to say and that you are very sorry about the situation. It’s enough,” Hintsanen says.

When faced with a crisis, openness helps preserve mental resources

When Varpu Hintsanen had to face the serious illness of her child, it was clear to her that she would like to talk about it openly. A previous life crisis, a divorce, had left her feeling like covering up a challenging life situation is just a waste of energy and results in loneliness.

“I acted like nothing was wrong and thought that I had to keep a poker face regardless of the situation. When I divorced the father of my children, it was important to me that no one saw how badly I was doing. It may be necessary at first, but you may end up stuck in that role.”

Hintsanen describes secrecy as armour for coping, which protects against unpleasant comments or advice, but also does not let through the compassion and help of other people. When her child fell ill, Hintsanen knew that she did not have the strength to keep the situation a secret. She posted on social media, saying that she does not know what will happen next in terms of her and her family’s lives. In addition, she stated that she would only answer the phone when she had the energy.

In a stressful life situation, the setting of clear boundaries and openness can help in the regulation of mental resources. When you are able to talk about the crisis you are facing, you also give people the chance to offer help and support.

“Now that I have experienced two major life crises, I’m happy that I made a different choice this time. Everything was much easier after that,” Hintsanen says.

It is important for the work community to understand that grief will never go away completely

Hintsanen’s child died of cancer in June 2019. Hintsanen sees grief and mourning differently now. “I do not subscribe to the concept of a mourning period in any way. Grief has no expiration date.”

Hintsanen says that, unfortunately, people often perceive grief as something to be overcome. She considers it important that work communities understand that grief will forever be a part of the life of someone who has experienced a loss. Everyday life is filled with tastes and smells that bring up memories, and the changing seasons will remind you of past Christmases and holidays.

Grief is an individual experience that cannot be turned into something that can be actively performed. Understanding the different stages of grief can be helpful when dealing with loss, but it is also just as important to allow individual grieving processes. When it comes to a loved one’s funeral or returning to work after a loss, it is important to do things in your own way and without the pressure of having to behave or act like others in a similar situation.

Instead of a funeral, Varpu Hintsanen felt it was important to organise a celebration of life for her child. The premises were decorated with balloons, the guests were dressed in colourful clothes, and the child’s favourite foods were served at the celebration.

“It is important to have the courage to do what you feel is right. I see it as an extremely important part of processing grief.”

Varpu Hintsanen did not return to the same job that she had take leave from when her child became ill. Her life had changed, and she no longer felt able to return to work to discuss experiences of inadequacy related to parenting with client families. Resignation was not an easy decision, as Hintsanen liked her job, workplace and co-workers.

Hintsanen’s supervisor was understanding about her resignation. Just like Hintsanen, the work community had changed a lot in three years. It was easy for Hintsanen to talk about her situation openly to her supervisor, who, as a skilled professional, knew how to listen and deal with matters openly and honestly.

Each and every one of us will have to face the death of someone we care about at some point. Challenges in our personal life are also reflected in our work role, which is shaped by experiences. Hintsanen emphasises that this is why it is also important to talk about death at workplaces. A skilled supervisor brings up matters with employees and actively maintains communication from the very beginning of the employment relationship. Facing and dealing with difficult issues is easier when communication and ways to discuss issues already exist. The employee’s responsibility to take care of themselves should not be forgotten either. Hintsanen encourages those who have experienced a loss to let others know how they would like their situation to be taken into account in the workplace.

Varpu Hintsanen did not give up nursing after her resignation. Instead, she started a business through which she can now help others who have experienced loss. In the midst of her own grief, Hintsanen found new ways to help herself in a difficult situation. This led to her learning things that she is now happy to share with work communities. “I feel like this showed me where my place is in the nursing field.”

The basic needs of working life are the same for everyone, regardless of age

Mehiläinen’s Pääasia podcast series discusses working life in a humane and bold way. In conversations with experts and guests from companies, the focus is on leadership, supervisory work and the well-being of the individual and the work community. This episode looks at what views different age groups have about working life. Our Occupational Health Physician Tytti Kerttula’s guests are Paula Kauppinen, a millennial who works as a Marketing Lead at Sofigate, and Kimmo Soini, who has already retired from his day job and is currently working as a Senior Advisor at Valor Partners and Nextmile Oy.

Money does not make up for a poor work atmosphere

The different working life needs of people of different ages have been discussed a lot, but, deep down, everyone has the same basic needs: the desire to be seen and accepted as themselves. According to Kauppinen, the younger generation is not satisfied with working just for money.

“Working nine-to-five is not enough. The work has to offer more than that, such as the opportunity to learn new things.”

Soini agrees with Kauppinen that money is not the most powerful motivator for working. However, the importance of pay varies depending on which stage of life one is at:

“When I had young children and a big mortgage, money played a bigger role than it does today. Throughout my career, however, the most important thing for me has been working in accordance with my own values in a good work community. Money cannot make up for a poor work atmosphere,” he says.

The career aspirations of millennials emphasise flexibility, fast career development and learning new things. On the other hand, learning new things and being able to change are already essential working life skills. For example, we must learn to use new technology and, at the same time, we should approach change with a positive attitude.

“Leadership should also take these wishes into account and monitor the end result of the work more closely. Today, time can be used flexibly, as we are not tied to an office,” Soini says.

“Goals will not be reached if the key people burn out.”

In the 2020s, incapacity for work caused by mental health challenges is more common than before. Soini points out that stress is not solely caused by the amount of work. Instead, he turns his attention above all to leadership and the team spirit of the workplace.

“Goals will not be reached if the key people burn out and the organisation lacks work ability,” Soini says.

Kauppinen also emphasises the importance of the company’s leadership and supervisory work. The entire company culture should be geared towards anticipating and preventing fatigue and burnout. Self-management is not enough if there is something wrong with the organisational culture.
“If I trust my supervisor so much that I tell them that I’m not feeling well, then something really has to be done about the thing that is bothering me,” Kauppinen says.

Soini and Kauppinen want more dialogue in the workplace. It is not necessary to agree on everything, but open discussion requires trust and the courage to share your thoughts. Soini says that he has been in situations during his career where he has not dared to participate in the discussion. According to his experience, this culture is now undergoing a major transformation.

“We millennials are no longer content with a culture in which we don’t feel good, and we won’t hesitate to leave such a workplace,” Kauppinen says.

How do organisations capitalise on senior employees?

At the end of careers, there is also room for improvement, especially in how organisations capitalise on senior employees. There is a prevailing belief that many people want to retire at the earliest possible retirement age and be on holiday for the rest of their life. Soini does not share this belief:

“It’s a bit of an on-off way of thinking, that you’re in a certain position until retirement age and then you leave. It could be useful to, for example, work part-time as an expert. By doing this, you can pass on your tacit knowledge.”

Soini himself has continued to work, as he feels that it makes his life fuller.

“I believe that if I keep active, I will have a good quality of life for years to come. Doing this won’t necessarily increase the number of years I have left, but maybe those years will be better,” Soini says with a smile.

In working life, there is also a large number of stressed parents of young children whose career development is well underway. This kind of life situation also requires compromises from the organisation. Is there a culture in the company where it’s okay to take your child to the doctor in the middle of the day and work the hours later?

During his career, Soini also remembers work communities where, for example, children’s doctor visits and paternity leave were not viewed favourably. In this, too, we are fortunately moving in the right direction, even if the situation is not yet ideal.

We need a balance between humans and machines

The role of humanity is increasingly emphasised in working life as artificial intelligence becomes part of everyday work. We should find a balance between humans and machines. Although a machine can perform certain tasks more accurately, there is no substitute for people’s genuine emotions. In addition, people’s performance is influenced by their motivation, that is, whether they put their heart into their work.

The dynamics of the work community have a huge impact on motivation. In addition to flexibility, remote work also creates challenges in finding common time and opportunities for interaction. Now, work communities need to think about how to build a sense of community when members of the community work remotely. Stressed people stay at home to work remotely, which can also signal that the work community is not so pleasant. Kauppinen hopes that co-workers will see each other face-to-face at least occasionally.

“Together, we can celebrate the successes and also share the bad days. If there is a conflict in the workplace, a good work community will resolve the matter openly and constructively,” Kauppinen says.

At the end of the episode, Kauppi and Soini convey the wishes and thoughts of their generation to each other:

“Each of us is an individual. For both sides, it’s important to listen and be present. I also think it’s important to share knowledge between the age groups, because the older generation can provide valuable, tacit knowledge for us younger people. Being different is an asset, and diversity in management and the company creates added value,” Kauppinen says.

“Senior employees have a lot of experience and opinions, but it’s important to challenge existing practices. Most of my age group believe that young people are the future. Dialogue is important in order to learn from the past and avoid making the same mistakes,” Soini says.

Kati Levoranta: “The most important task of a leader is to help the team members succeed”

Mehiläinen’s Pääasia podcast series discusses working life in a humane and bold way. In conversations with experts and guests from companies, the focus is on leadership, supervisory work and the well-being of the individual and the work community. The first episode of the series focuses on the leader’s body and mind as occupational psychologist Nina Hynninen welcomes Kati Levoranta as her guest. Levoranta’s background is in law and she currently works at P2X Solutions Ltd, a start-up that fights climate change and builds green hydrogen and synthetic fuel production facilities. Her family includes a spouse, two adult children and a beloved dog.

The work community needs emotional intelligence and humanity

There have been major changes in leadership over the last 10 years. According to Levoranta, the importance of hierarchy has diminished and, at the same time, team-based work has become more common. Especially the younger generation needs a more conversational leadership style. Young people thrive in a work environment that takes into account inclusivity and psychological safety. Working in accordance with your own values is a key part of caring for your body and mind.

“Certain things, such as trust and goal setting, have already been part of leadership. Now their importance becomes even more pronounced. Team members need to understand what is expected of them,” Levoranta says.

Levoranta also emphasises humanity. Right now, artificial intelligence and machine learning are receiving a lot of attention, but emotional intelligence and humane encounters are still needed in work communities. In addition, the pandemic and the transition to remote work brought new perspectives to leadership: how exactly should remote and hybrid work be led?

“Remote work highlights the importance of the body and mental well-being. Exercise and sports have been important to me since I was a child, and I still hold on to them. For some, well-being can be improved by hiking or culture,” Levoranta says.

Levoranta’s background in sports has helped her be a better leader, mainly by making her more systematic, determined and disciplined. The big lesson she points out is that no matter how good the plan, life always has unexpected setbacks. When this happens, it is important to keep moving forward and not dwell on failure.

“When I was younger, I played tennis, where you inevitably make bad shots every now and then. You can’t get stuck on them. Instead, you have to learn from them and continue the game,” Levoranta says with a smile.

Mistakes and challenging situations can understandably make you feel down for a while. In addition to exercise, Levoranta is also supported by family and friends. At work, a good team and team spirit also help the leader, because the strength of a team is enormous. It’s important to actively deal with difficult situations so that the team can avoid making the same mistakes in the future. After that, it’s time let go of the mistakes and look forward.

“Trying to cheer up is not enough – things have to be dealt with.”

Leaders are for team members

The mind, body and facial expressions communicate a lot about how we are feeling at the workplace. Sometimes, personal issues can have an impact on work. Everyone has bad days. In demanding situations, your mind may play tricks on you. In these situations, Levoranta encourages people to divide tasks into smaller parts and focus on one thing at a time. It’s important for the leader to trust the team and, if necessary, to openly say if something is bothering them.

“The leader should be aware of what kind of message they are conveying with their presence. People observe the leader and sometimes draw very far-reaching conclusions that may not be correct. I encourage positive communication.”

Difficult moments for Levoranta as a leader have included, for example, having to lay off personnel and experiencing stress because of it. In such situations, it’s necessary to find ways to manage stress that work for you. Levoranta points out that hardly any leader is superhuman, which means that sleep, among other things, is important for everyone. She has also faced a situation in her own life where she struggled to cope:

“In 2020, my father became seriously ill and there were several practical challenges in my life. I found myself overwhelmed, and even my blood pressure was affected by the stress. I had to stop and think about what really matters. At work, my team helped me, and my parents shared their deep wisdom and advice with me. They stressed the need to make choices in life. You have to slow down where you can.”

At the end of the episode, Kati Levoranta explains what kind of legacy she would like to leave as a leader:

“Leaders are for team members, not the other way around. Leadership is a service profession and it is the job of leaders to help others succeed,” she says.